Jdubit,
Do you suggest we all live off the land then? Government just gives life structure so we don't all turn into nomads.

I think that verses "context," its when pilate asked Jesus if he was a king, and Jesus said His kingdom was something else than "of this world." I mean Jesus did come as a warrior bringing down government, it isn't evil. I doubt you would even be typing now if the structure of a government didn't make the ability to create computers. I totally support the structure of government. I bet you do to, since you still live in a country and aren't living in a forest somewhere. I say you trash your computer, it's a symbol of this evil government. Move to a forest and live out your beliefs.

Originally posted by: Kadesh

Jdubit,
Do you suggest we all live off the land then? Government just gives life structure so we don't all turn into nomads.

I think the "context" of that is when pilate asked Jesus if he was a king, and Jesus said His kingdom was something else than "of this world." I mean Jesus did come as a warrior bringing down government, it isn't evil. I doubt you would even be typing now if the structure of a government didn't make the ability to create computers. I totally support the structure of government. I bet you do to, since you still live in a country and aren't living in a forest somewhere. I say you trash your computer, it's a symbol of this evil government. Move to a forest and live out your beliefs.

lol, you can live under a governments authority without giving support to it. it doesn't mean that living under a government doesn't have some advantages today, but by voting for officials, you are actively participating in the government. it's misplaced hope. your hope is in man to solve our problems, not in God's Kingdom, which is where Jesus' hope lied.

it also says, " and to aspire to live quietly, and to mind your own affairs, and to work with your hands, as we instructed you, so that you may walk properly before outsiders and be dependent on no one."
1 Thessalonians 4:11

"And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth"
-gen 9:1


Working with your hands, implies more than just "working with your hands," it implies working with purpose more than only for self. That purpose would be a job under the umbrella of a government.

God gives us responsibility right? To be "fruitful" and "multiply." He made us as "one" to come together. How can we be fruitful, if we don't have any structure to be "fruitful" in? There's nothing wrong with government. We as humans need it to function. We aren't supposed to be stuck in our little bubble. We need to support a "system" that allows humanity to function. Makes sense to me. I think I will. I do agree though, we can't place our hope in a system. It's only a tool. I wouldn't put my hope in a shovel, only the usability.

Originally posted by: Kadesh

it also says, " and to aspire to live quietly, and to mind your own affairs, and to work with your hands, as we instructed you, so that you may walk properly before outsiders and be dependent on no one."
1 Thessalonians 4:11

"And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth"
-gen 9:1


God gives us responsibility right? To be "fruitful" and "multiply." He made us as "one" to come together. How can we be fruitful, if we don't have any structure to be "fruitful" in? There's nothing wrong with government. We as humans need it to function. We aren't supposed to be stuck in our little bubble. We need to support a "system" that allows humanity to function. Makes sense to me. I think I will. I do agree though, we can't place our hope in a system. It's only a tool. I wouldn't put my hope in a shovel, only the usability.

none of this suggests that we are to place hope in human governments/kingdoms for salvation. in order to avoid this, we should be neutral in all worldly politics.

look bro, I'm not arguing that we should put our hope in government/kingdoms for salvation. I never said that. I'm just saying we should work inside it. Not abandon it. You'll set yourself up to be alone.

Originally posted by: Kadesh

look bro, I'm not arguing that we should put our hope in government/kingdoms for salvation. I never said that. I'm just saying we should work inside it. Not abandon it. You'll set yourself up to be alone.

voting for a government official is the same as placing hope/faith in that particular government. hope that they're going to fix the mess they created. it's not likely. try having faith in God's Kingdom, the only way mankind will truly be saved. dabbling in worldly politics is not going to do you any good.




this has to do with the issue raised in the garden of eden. the sovereignty issue. who has the right to rule? who knows what is best for mankind? certainly not any of the governments that exist today.

the case has been made already. humans can not rule themselves without God. we will destroy all life on Earth if we're left to our own devices. pretty soon He will put an end to this sick world and all of the governments that reside in it.

“In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times indefinite.” Daniel 2:44

We're living in the days of "those kings"! Good times are ahead however!

haha crunkmoose- all of the good anarchists that I know defend Obama policies.

Originally posted by: jdubit

Originally posted by: Kadesh

look bro, I'm not arguing that we should put our hope in government/kingdoms for salvation. I never said that. I'm just saying we should work inside it. Not abandon it. You'll set yourself up to be alone.

voting for a government official is the same as placing hope/faith in that particular government. hope that they're going to fix the mess they created. it's not likely. try having faith in God's Kingdom, the only way mankind will truly be saved. dabbling in worldly politics is not going to do you any good.




this has to do with the issue raised in the garden of eden. the sovereignty issue. who has the right to rule? who knows what is best for mankind? certainly not any of the governments that exist today.

the case has been made already. humans can not rule themselves without God. we will destroy all life on Earth if we're left to our own devices. pretty soon He will put an end to this sick world and all of the governments that reside in it.

1 samuel 16

"whine"that he really really shouldn't increase the taxes on the wealthiest...."

Originally posted by: Kadesh

unfair taxing though,if your rich, you get taxed more. there isn't much incentive to make good products or invent new things/new ways of doing things....

Are you fucking kidding me? So, if you have to pay higher taxes... and lets keep in mind Obama has proposed a THREE FUCKING PERCENT RAISE IN TAXES FOR THE WEALTHIEST.. THREE FUCKING PERCENT, which would bring theirs to a whopping 30% tax rate.. the highest we ever experienced being just over 90 percent, which coincided with FUCKING EPIC economic growth in this country... then you won't have incentive to make good products or invent new things? So.. you WON'T have incentive to make more money?... because you won't be able to keep quite as much of that money? Do you even think this shit through before you say it?

Also, dumb fuck... NOT making good products is detrimental to the bottom line for most companies, as people don't like to buy shit products. Inventing new things is not the sole province of the already wealthy. Plenty of folks do so because they have an idea who are NOT rich (yet), and in businesses its not usually the rich owner who has all the ideas for new shit.

You are arguing that because they would keep slightly less of their income, rich people would just refuse to make more money for themselves. You realize that, right?.. and you realize it MAKES NO FUCKING SENSE, right?

Originally posted by: Man is Truth

haha crunkmoose- all of the good anarchists that I know defend Obama policies.

Sorry if I am not doctrinaire enough for you or idealistic enough to think that government is going to collapse in the next 6 months, so there is no need to worry about how things actually are right now and will be for the foreseeable future.

I never claimed to be a "good anarchist".. just an anarchoprimitivist. I have ideals I prefer to work towards, but I won't ignore today in the name of a possible future that doesn't look to come during my lifetime.

Originally posted by: jdubit

“In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times indefinite.” Daniel 2:44

We're living in the days of "those kings"! Good times are ahead however!

1 Thessalonians 5:2

"those" days are not a time. It just says those as in ..."?"... I'm sure God will be set against them then, but not now. Who are you to say "now," kinda arrogant to call yourself god (and know the day and hour), don't you think? We should all be listening to you if you know the day and hour, but I think your nuts man to be that arrogant.

BIBLE FIGHT!!!!

biggest bible wins....